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Thread: how welcome in PCMR

  1. #1
    Anonymous
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    how welcome in PCMR

    I just got an earful about the rut situation at Nationals. I understand the ruts were so bad in Beaver Creek because they really didn't want Nastar Nationals there and so did not dedicate the mountain maintenece crew to the job. Does Park City prove they want Nationals there and dedicate the staff to take care of us. There are no rules about alleviating ruts (I believe) so why do I keep hearing such bad stories. Skiodor-- whats the story?

  2. #2
    Senior Member
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    Im not skidoro and he probably knows what PC does, but I know that they weren't as bad as I thought they would be when I went. Its probably not much worse than your local hill :roll:
    www.Paskiandride.com/
    ^^Check it out^^

  3. #3
    Anonymous
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    The Reality of Ruts

    PCMR has probably one of the biggest race programs in the Nation. They have full time staff and tons of volunteers. This will be, I believe the third year they have hosted the largest recreational race in the world. So do not fear their commitment to the race itself.

    The realities of ruts are, however, beyond any amount of course maintenance. There are things that everyone can do to help mitigate the severity or shape of the ruts but the weather and snow conditions will dictate ultimately what conditions you race in.

    With well over 200 runs per course, your seed, which is the luck of the draw can put you in well formed ruts or pot holes and another racer can get smooth ruts, "cookies", "sugar" or pot holes.

    My suggestion, I am mean this kindness and having been running HUGE ruts all year, just ski your race and don't worry about things one cannot control. I don't worry about ruts, I ski my line and do what is necessary based on what I'm going over run to run.

    I can go on about how to approach all the different ruts conditions but won't here.

    Here is the one thing we can ALL DO to get the ruts smooth regardless of the conditions.

    [size=18]SLIP THE COURSE WITH IN COOPERATION WITH THE RACE DIRECTORS

    Slipping Etiquette

    1) Always ask for permission to slip or if they want you to (usually the starter and his staff)

    2) Always look upon hill and listen for "On Course" and know where to exit the course

    3) NEVER GO THROUGH THE TIMING LIGHTS!!!!!

    4) Push the loose snow AWAY from the track, not into it.

    Good Luck to All!

    8)

  4. #4
    Senior Member
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    Re: The Reality of Ruts

    Originally posted by Skiodor


    3) NEVER GO THROUGH THE TIMING LIGHTS!!!!!

    4) Push the loose snow AWAY from the track, not into it.

    VERY FREAKING IMPORTANT!!! Its great to get a six second time on a 30 second corse...But its not great if you have to rerun if you had a good run :x
    www.Paskiandride.com/
    ^^Check it out^^

  5. #5
    Anonymous
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    Re: how welcome in PCMR

    Originally posted by guest
    I just got an earful about the rut situation at Nationals. whats the story?
    I can't imagine any mountain would intentionally encourage or ignore ruts. Personally, I thank any mountain willing to take on the work of holding a regional or national NASTAR race. Having worked at many races, I can tell you it's a significant commitment. (Remember to thank those who are there working this year.)

    Slipping the course during the race can help plow down the burms. But, having worked as a starter, I know it is very difficult to decide who can slip, who can't, and when -- especially considering that NASTAR is a recreational organization that attracts a broad range of talent. If I were the starter, I really wouldn't relish having unknown faces asking me if they could slip at a national championship race; my standard answer would be "no". Still, I don't want to give up on the idea of more course maintenance.

    One suggestion is to for us to volunteer (e.g., sign-up) for course maintenance responsibilities and get a quick check out, some type of ID (a colored bib?), and some instruction on the day before the race. That way, race officials know who should be near the course and who shouldn't.

    It may be too late for this year, but I'd hope that NASTAR HQ might consider it for next year. There are many racers that are used to pitching in to run races and others that are willing to learn. Enlisting volunteers would help all of us have a good experience at a reasonable cost.

    A second suggestion - don't slip the course itself during inspection - even if you are just in a wedge. Rather, slip right alongside the course by avoiding the expected path between the gates and not slipping or wedging through the gates themselves. You can get just as good a view and save unneeded traffic.

    The officials have probably "salted" the course to firm up the surface and reduce rutting. The extra traffic of inspection can easily gouge the course. In essence, if everyone inspects, then we have an extra 300 (or so) runs through the course. Yes, a wedge isn't as severe, but I've seen some people really dig in their edges when inspecting, and that definitely eats away at the treated surface.

  6. #6
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    You think they will actully salt? That would be atleast 16 corses (8 duals)
    for 2 days...32 and then if they do any resetting..>Gonna be an expencive bill for recreational races :?
    www.Paskiandride.com/
    ^^Check it out^^

  7. #7
    Anonymous
    Guest
    I just looked at the 14 day forecast for Park City. I think we can expect to be in ruts up to our arm pits. It hardly dips below 50 degrees between now and then :shock:

  8. #8
    Anonymous
    Guest

    PC Weather

    Originally posted by Anonymous
    I just looked at the 14 day forecast for Park City.  I think we can expect to be in ruts up to our arm pits.  It hardly dips below 50 degrees between now and then  :shock:
    For the best info, go here

    http://www.wrh.noaa.gov/cgi-bin/wrhq/Total...t+WR+UT+009+013

    [size=18]Ruts, we don't care about no stinkin' ruts!

  9. #9
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Well, I'd like to think so...

    Originally posted by skidude
    You think they will actully salt?  That would be atleast 16 corses (8 duals)
    for 2 days...32 and then if they do any resetting..>Gonna be an expencive bill for recreational races :?
    I saw them "salt" (actually fertilizer - don't worry eco fans!) in 2002. I don't expect the same treatment that a USSA race would get 'cause it's just not feasible. But, I would guess they would spread some down 1/2 to 1 hour before pacesetting started. (Unless it is literally 70 degrees. In that case, I'm not sure that even salting would work as the snow probably won't refreeze.)

    Still, ruts will develop if it stays as warm as it is.

    Oh well, look at it this way, assuming everyone follows in the tracks of the pacesetter, then the ruts will set a good line and everyone will know when to turn. :wink: :o

  10. #10
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Re: Well, I'd like to think so...(part II)

    Originally posted by Bob
    Still, ruts will develop if it stays as warm as it is.  

    Ooops - forgot something.

    At the Piche Invitational I saw a neat trick. Gunstock didn't groom the trail the night before. They just let it sit and freeze solid the night before. Then, they had everyone slip the course to shake off the loose stuff. The ice that resulted lasted the whole day.

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